This morning, the students in FY100 06 are viewing the new What Is Worship? DVD released by Vineyard Music, and that forms the basis for the What Is Worship? events we’ve been up to in Europe.
So, here is the question for InResponse for this week:
In what ways did the themes of this DVD re-shape your vision of what worship is?
What were the phrases or ideas that you found especially impacting?
How would the ideas surrounding the imago Dei and the “wiring for worship” human beings have in them reform present church practice and our view of culture?
How did you feel about the discussion on the “sacred/secular” concept vs. the “One World” view?
“All that is, is sacred.” Thomas Merton
16 Comments
Hey Dan, i wasn’t sure if i was to answer all questions or just one, so im just going to elaborate on the first one.
All the themes in the dvd really got me thinking about what worship really is and how i can acutally worship non-stop, everyday of my life no matter what im doing or where i am. Now in reality it would be extremely difficult to actually pull something like that off because we are all sinners and live in the world.
I have been thinking a lot lately though about how can worshipping god be evident in a lot more places in my life than on sunday mornings. When you think about it, it doesn’t have to be much more different than how you act and live now…its just key to keep in the back of your mind the idea that the decisions and actions you make will reflect the important things in your life. If god is an important part of it than it will be evident in the way you conduct yourself. We mentioned this story in class but i think its a great example of worship…Dan got back about a buck extra in change which he took it back, against my advisory, and i dont know too many people who would do that but it just shows the employees and everyone in line, me included, that somethings different with him.
Well thats just a bit of what ive been thinking about how i can always be worshiping and it showing up in different aspects of my life. The dvd was great for helping to give ideas.
Th dvd put a lot of my experiences, my trials and errors and stuff learnt and yet to be learnt into words. i like the point made in the dvd how people were AMAZED, SHOCKED, STUNNED by what jesus did so they can’t help but to burst into praise and into song. i also find the following thought very refreshing: we choose to sing and praise because we are called to sum up creation’s voice in articulate praise to our maker, and that it is because it something everyone can do anywhere together. A unity is brought by praise and worship in song.
personally i think the part on how intimacy with jesus, reading his word every day and searching for him even when you don’t feel like it is so important. Also the part on how our daily lives should be a kind of worship to God. A worship lifestyle is so much more real sometimes than standing on the stage with your guitar and sing. This is also what i myself, and among people i know, find the hardest to do. And still am stumbling here : )
The worldview thing is what intrigues me most (probably because of all the philosophy classes i’ve been having) I look at the sacred world as the white colour, and the secular world a million of colours (well, at least all the colours in the rainbow). They seem like the opposite, yet when all the colours spin together, they become the white colour. Same–the secular world is the sacred world, only fallen (Joel made this comment i think). We need to learn to take our the dirty and grimy colours of the secular palette, and we will find the sacred wolrd even purer.
Ok, first let me say that worship for me is like air-essentail so for me the video simple reinforced where I am already at.
At the same time I found myself touched by the comment about how we often live as though we are two different people and how those two live can affect my time with God. That commnet was and is a lived in experience daily. From that experience it is easy for me to say that having two world often comes out of a need for security from everything. It’s a place to retreat that is safe(mostly) and to be real and true. The true worship comes from stepping out of that and allowing God to completely either combine the two or remove one and then living expressly on his strengh and know him. I can understand why so many choose to hold on to it.
As to being made the image of God and being wired to worship it totally explains a few things for for me that I am not comfortable sharing right now.
The other comment that impacted me was the true meaning of holiness being the certain things I do and not doing others because I am a child of God, not because of who might be watching. which by the way is totally true and yet somehow I often get lost in what others might think or the more pevailing views. This definition of holiness offers me the challenge of aiming for nothing less than the best.
I will say that the themes expressed by the Worship DVD helped me clarify some of my concepts/perceptions of what worship is. Particularly when Dan -so enthusiastically!- said that worship was an attempt to become like the worshipped; the Ancients have done so from the beginning of civilization. This is what I realize is the soul form of worship, to simply go before God and desire to be changed by His power. And isn’t that what can pleases Him?
A phrase from the video that remains with me would be “The Glory of God is a Human Being Fully Alive” It is His Spirit (breath) that makes us complete.
I’m greatly moved by the idea of humanity being the stewards of creation, the ones who present creation before God in caring for it and ejoying it. We have been given the ability to reason worship. All of creation professes but we can confess, we can know why!
The Imago Die, in my mind, is to return to the Cross. It is the true image of God. But, the secular mindset has made it into an plain image of death. It has taken God out of the equation, so that the event became a symbolic sacrificial offering.(secular is not denying God but not knowing Him and so not seeing) But, what did Jesus say on the cross? “It is finished!” He suffered to death, true. He poured out His life, true also. That is what the cross means: a sign of passionate (suffering to love) life giving.
Dan, feel free to correct my understanding of secular because i feel that i dont have a correct grasp of it. that’s what i have to say about that!
Me again to answer the rest of the questions.
For me the phrases that really stuck out in the movie are definetley the secular/non-secular world views and, like cora-lee, the one about having two seperate lives and how it affected my relationship with god. I always had this skewed picture in my mind that all my secular freinds would not want to hear anything about jesus becuase i assumed they wouldnt be at all interested and a waste of time. I sold them short by not believing that god actually did have a life for them and with them. Along those same lines, i did my best to keep my secular freinds and lifestyle seperate from everything else in my life that had to do with god. It was a lot of work, very stressful and very destructive towards my relationship with god.
I think the “wiring for worship” human beings have helped immensly in progressing the style of worship in modern day church. People are always thinking of new ways to express their love for the god that has done so much for them and through god, new songs and ways of worship are devoloped that keep them relevent and becoming to the culture surrounding them.
I have already touched on the sacred/secular concept but just want to say again that assuming the secular world doesn’t want a part of god and to keep them seperate in no matter what we do and to exlude them is the opposite of what jesus taught and wants. The quote sums it up, everything on this planet is sacred and we must treat it that way no matter how dirty or messed up we see it.
Well, for those of the blog readers who have not watched the dvd, let me just tell you a few words of the ideas surrounding the “imago Dei”. Actually it was pictured as a circle, the “imago Dei” being the center. Twelve ideas were arranged all around the circle, reminding of a clock. These items were grouped into a higher category, forming quarters of three items each.
The ideas resp. categories were the following:
Intimacy (our life with God)
1) corporate expression
2) personal expression
3) prayer
Impact (our life in the world)
4) holiness
5) compassion
6) proclamation
Community (our life with each other)
church
7) family
9) culture
Character (our life within)
10) character growth
11) pursuit of truth
12) wholeness
Similar to Jennifer and Jason, I was moved by the idea that N.T. Wright had expressed: Man’s task is to be a mirror; on the one hand side reflecting God’s traits towards creation, and on the other hand side gathering creation’s silent worship (the singing of the trees, clapping of the hills etc.) and lending it a voice, presenting it to God. This is so beautiful!
Actually, I gained a lot from watching the dvd. So many profound ideas have been expressed that one can hardly take them all in, watching the dvd just once – that’s why I watched it twice, actually, and certainly not for the last time (thanks so much, Dan, for interviewing all these people and sharing it! What a gift!)
What I personally found most impacting at this time was “Expressing worship through our relationship with our family”. I guess, that’s partly because I have just been married a few weeks ago. I always found the idea challenging to put family before everything else (except God, of course). I have been more interested in my career so far (actually, it was hard for me to leave it all behind and come here, for I really loved my secular job and colleagues). All three statements (by Dan Wilt, Kathryn Scott and Matt Redman) touched me deep within when they pointed out that it is one of the most important acts of worship to try to be the best Mummy or Dad resp. wife or husband, that we can possibly be.
What I liked best about the DVD is the passion that you see in each of the speakers. Their hearts for worship, no matter what their vocation, are so encouraging and inspiering. I love how Peter Fitch read his passages, and how Kathryn and Matt talked about the family dynamic. Litening to N.T. Wright and Peter Davids makes you almost want to be a scholar, and Brian makes you want to be a songwriter. And echoing what Jason said, I loved the passion with which Dan speaks. The effect that the whole thing had on me was something like the way Jack Nicolson responds to Helen Hunt in ‘As good as it Gets’ – “They make me want to be a better worshiper!”
I was very impressed by the illistration of the sacred versus the secular. It has always been evident to me that the two truths existed, but the way the movie put it made it clear that WE do the separating.
I think it is really important to view the world as “the world” not separate from God. The emphasis on the two worlds not being two worlds, but one, was very insightful for me.
I also was interested to see all of the worship leaders, pastors and writers speek about their views on worship, and the passion they all had individually for it. It was very cool to see the songwriters of songs that i know and love give their input on “what is worship”. It makes me feel good knowing that their hearts and pointed in the right direction.
I know we discussed a lot of elements of the DVD after watching it. But I just want to reiterate what I said and then add to it…. possibly. Anyway, I was most intrigued by what N T Wright had to say about how everything we do can be a form of worship. Weather it’s sleeping, working or just ordinary life. Everything we do can remind us that God is there. We talked about going for a jog as being worship, but we then asked, “Well what if God was an after thought and we just needed to fit him in somewhere so we’re going to fit him into our daily jog”. Personally I usually set time aside for God. I find times by myself (it could be on a walk) is when I can reflect the most. I like to call them “Jesus walks”.
In the DVD it says how God expresses how the world is sacred yet it is fallen. I think were all living in one world, even though it may become categorized at times. We need to have the sacred mixed with the secular. I know a lot of Christian friends of mine want to become pastors, which is great that they feel called to this, however I think we need to spread out into the world and minister to other fields. We need Christian doctors, firemen, accountants, astronauts etc. I guess this is my view on the whole 2 world theory. Hopefully it made sense.
This is just something that kind of stuck with me. One of the authors at the end mentioned mountain tops. When I think of mountain tops I think of times when you know for sure that you met with God. I hope I get one of these “mountain top experiences” in my lifetime. For now I’m in the valley!
Best Blessings!
Britney
The truest act of worship is a human being fully alive. The glory of God is a human being fully alive. I think is the most impactful phrase of the DVD and with further reflection will begin to reshape my vision of worship. The truest act of worship is a human being fully alive.
A human being fully alive articluates all of creation in corporate worship.
A human being fully alive feeds on the revelation of God in personal worship.
A human being full alive finds intimacy with God in prayer as woship.
A human being fully alive does certain things and does not do certain things because of who she is, worshipping God through holiness.
A human being fully alive has a fragrant life as she worships God through proclomation.
A human being fully alive loves his neighbor and God with integrity and worships God through compassion.
A human being fully alive makes sandwiches and wipes runny noses, worshipping God through family commitments.
A human being fully alive tends to her relationships in her church family and worships God through church.
A human being fully alive loves the valley and worships God through character formation.
A human being fully alive seeks to have a thoughtful heart and feeling mind, seeks knowledge and worships God through her pursuit of truth.
A human being fully alive is mentally, emotionally and physically whole and worships God through this wholeness.
I have to ponder a little longer on the other questions before I can respond.
1) In what ways did the themes of this DVD re-shape your vision of what worship is?
It didn’t exactly re-shape as much as refreshed the idea that all of creation is always occupied in worship of God, and that worship is not [just] song, it can be anything and always happening.
2) What were the phrases or ideas that you found specially impacting?
“The glory of God is a human being fully alive.”
3) How would the ideas surrounding the “imago Dei” and the “wiring for worship” human beings have in them reform present church practice and our view of culture?
If we really understood how we are made in God’s image, and are here to worship him, we’d place a lot more importance on making sure that worship was always happening. I think it’s also easier to understand all the worship that goes on in other cultures of objects/false gods, since worship is like an unstoppable force inside that must get out somehow.
4) How did you feel about the discussion on the “sacred/secular” concept vs. the “One World” view?
I much prefer the One World view. There are no reasons to have more divisions in the world than there already are, unless God himself put them there. God made everything sacred – he didn’t make some things called sacred and another group called secular. They were all One.
Crew,
These comments are beautiful, and encouraging. I can see thinking behind the words, and hope behind the phrases.
Well done. I’m sure you had some rousing conversation last Wednesday, as you’ve had today as well. Fantastic.
When you write, write in sentences, or in bullets, but with thoughtful attention to grammar, spelling, sentence structure, etc. While these elements won’t be graded in these InReflection posts, you may as well get in good habits as your first papers come due. Grading will take those factors into account on papers.
Again, I’m thrilled with the insights you’ve each brought hear, and I’ve read each one. I trust your further “venture into worldview” with Joel today resulted in some great discoveries as well. I look forward to seeing you on Wednesday.
Again, blessings and well done.
Well i really had to think about the question, how did the dvd change my view on worship.
My immediate response was that i had worship sust but then i softened myself to Joel’s talk about all aspects of life being worship. Oh i was aware of this before but when he said that you can worship just by apprietating God’s creation or having a really nice coffee and enjoying it. I said that if you realise that you’re enjoying it and thank God for it and then carry on enjoying it, then thats worship. He then replied, is it not just worship enjoying the fresh air or the nice coffee? is it not just worship going for a jog? i then said, yes if you deigate that time to him! I not the act of jogging worship itself? At first i swore blind that i was right and then i asked God to soften my heart to this and after a week i was softened to the idea and i started to embrass the idea. Now i believe that not just the times i give to God as worship are glorifying him but the times that i enjoy life, i am glorifying him.
So the dvd open this question in discuss and therefore had an indirect impact of the way i veiw worship.
Thankyou for reading! May God bless you and be with you for the rest of your lives.
The themes in this video did not necessarily reshape my vision of what worship is, but I enjoyed and was enriched by the presentation. Dan, great summation, “Worship is about a whole life response to the Love of God.” The scripture passages you included are ones that have also influenced my theology. In the ‘why you worship section’, you included John 4:19, ‘we love because He first loved us’. It does makes a difference if it is His initiative (or invitation) – like you said, worship is not about putting on a show or impressing God (perhaps we can not offer anything except from what initially is given from Him) – it is a response.
NT Wright gave some interesting insight into Imago Dei, saying the task of humans, as image bearers, is to reflect God into the world, His likeness into creation. He used the metaphor of an angled mirror; God being reflected into creation, and then this reflects back to God, a response of creation. The gathering up of the actions of creation to praise God. NT Wright goes on to explain that we are the flower, or crown of creation. This reminds me of one time (experience) when the Lord re-affirmed that He liked that I was an ‘artist’, showing me that He was in fact an artist, the Master Artist. And then I thought, yeah, its ok if I go into life and just create (and I enjoy it so much), that’s good enough. But then He said, BUT… His prized piece of art is people, the hearts of man. He showed me how they were the crown of creation in His heart. And what God had to say to me went full circle. Being creative is not enough, the most important things I would do in life would involve the hearts of man, because this is what is most important to the Lord.
I had never before heard NT Wright’s distinction made in Revelation 4, creation saying ‘holy, holy, holy’, and humans (24 elders) saying, ‘you are worthy to receive this praise because you have made all this.’ We, the crown of creation, call the rest of creation to praise (perhaps they are already doing this (?)… but evidently we are still called to call them to praise… hmmm). What NT Wright highlights here is that humans are given a mind to know that God is worthy, and we unlike creation, choose to worship. I guess that is not such a new concept. I just hadn’t seen it in Revelation 4 before. Later on in the video Peter Fitch says that the great journey is to go from the image of God to the likeness of Christ, this involves many aspects, some of which were touched on in the video.
I loved Matt Redman’s phrase, ‘revelation is the fuel for the fire of worship.’ And Tim Hugh encouraged us to pursue, ‘the mystery’, to ‘capture the wonder of God’. It is so true, coming into greater revelation of God means that ‘we will be satisfied and dissatisfied at the same time.’
I took great interest in David Ruis’ comment on how the ‘gathering together’ of the early church for worship was largely out of desperation, for encouragement, to cry and rejoice together, use gifts, building each other up, gaining strength to go on. This ‘missional’ aspect is generally absent in many comfy western churches. I attended David’s church in Winnipeg from around 96 – 98. Its abandonment to love the Lord and share His love was undeniably special, and its relationship with the Holy Spirit incredibly tangible, the level of ‘revelation’ and ‘response’ were hightened. DR and Brian D also remarked that loving the Lord is susinct with loving your brother. They both mention that Jesus recognizes us by our love, ‘I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink’. The Lord cannot receive our worship if it is divorced from His heart. If there is incongruence with our love of God through our lack of love for our brother, it is not a reflection of Him. And therefore becomes a clanging gong, a clamoring cymbol.
Lastly to mention, I love John Eldridge’s emphasis that Jesus came that we may ‘have life, and have it fully’. It is a partner to perhaps one of my favorite quotes of all time, “The glory of God is a human being fully alive,” Iraeneus.
How would the ideas surrounding Imago Dei or ‘wiring for worship’ presented in this video reform present church practice or view of culture? Assuming this is suggesting western churches, even then it is hard to know what present church practice refers to. I’ve been involved in many different styles of church practice. I think they call for a person who is radically committed to living for revelation of God, and for going deeper into relationship with God in a wholly given response. A holistic approach to both church and culture, where we see and worship God in every area of life and society.
Due to sickness, I missed the discussion on ’sacred/secular’ concept vs. the ‘One World’ view. My guess is that the view that some things are sacred and other things secular was challenged by the concept that all things can be sacred. Theologically I see that the Lord loved His creation and called it ‘good’ (must have been good in the fullest expression that ‘good’ can be), and although our relationship with Him was damaged through sin and the influence of demonic activity, Jesus Christ gave us the free gift of forgiveness, reconciliation, and restoration. In139th Psalm we are told there is no place we can go from His presence that even dark is as light to Him. And Hebrews nothing can separate us from the love of Christ, angel, demon, famine, sword. If the Kingdom of God is within us, His presence and our worship to Him, the sacred can be in any ‘place’. Like we learn from Brother Lawrence, any place can be sacred, and filled with His presence.
la
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