Comments on: Spirituality & The Formation Of The Worship Leader: Francis Of Assisi and Gregory of Nyssa http://www.danwilt.com/spirituality-the-formation-of-the-worship-leader-assisi/ spiritual storytelling, keeping faith Thu, 09 Feb 2012 16:27:13 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Shawn http://www.danwilt.com/spirituality-the-formation-of-the-worship-leader-assisi/#comment-37093 Shawn Tue, 03 Apr 2007 23:56:45 +0000 http://www.danwilt.com/index.php/spirituality-the-formation-of-the-worship-leader-assisi/#comment-37093 Reading Gregory and Francis together really stretches the idea of how to live as a Christian. With Gregory, the sum of the way of perfection is friendship with God. There is nothing we can do to impress him, and though we ought to try to live a life that is pleasing to God, the best motivation for this is to try and please him as we would a friend. This seems to me to be in contrast to Francis is some ways. True, Francis seems to have a deep relationship with God, but the deeds and stories of his life, like those in the readings, seem unattainable to me. The need for a supernatural experience to prove my worthiness to God seems to lessen the value of relationship with him. As one who has tried all manner of spiritual gymnastics to prove my worth to both God and myself, I understand this way of thinking, but I like the idea of friendship better. To approach God in a relationship, where I accept his love for me, and show my love for him by serving what he loves seems doable. The problem with spiritual gymnastics is that once you have completed your latest “trick”, you have to come up with another one to impress the audience, even an audience of One. I don’t think he is impressed much by that. Rather, my sense of the word is that he is impressed by loving relationships where we can move beyond just what feels right for me, and reach out beyond ourselves to try and walk with others through their struggles and joys. The whole incarnation speaks of this, and to be Christ like, we must allow him to work this same kind of life through us. Reading Gregory and Francis together really stretches the idea of how to live as a Christian. With Gregory, the sum of the way of perfection is friendship with God. There is nothing we can do to impress him, and though we ought to try to live a life that is pleasing to God, the best motivation for this is to try and please him as we would a friend.

This seems to me to be in contrast to Francis is some ways. True, Francis seems to have a deep relationship with God, but the deeds and stories of his life, like those in the readings, seem unattainable to me. The need for a supernatural experience to prove my worthiness to God seems to lessen the value of relationship with him. As one who has tried all manner of spiritual gymnastics to prove my worth to both God and myself, I understand this way of thinking, but I like the idea of friendship better.

To approach God in a relationship, where I accept his love for me, and show my love for him by serving what he loves seems doable. The problem with spiritual gymnastics is that once you have completed your latest “trick”, you have to come up with another one to impress the audience, even an audience of One. I don’t think he is impressed much by that. Rather, my sense of the word is that he is impressed by loving relationships where we can move beyond just what feels right for me, and reach out beyond ourselves to try and walk with others through their struggles and joys. The whole incarnation speaks of this, and to be Christ like, we must allow him to work this same kind of life through us.

]]> By: Dan Frye http://www.danwilt.com/spirituality-the-formation-of-the-worship-leader-assisi/#comment-24032 Dan Frye Fri, 16 Feb 2007 03:22:24 +0000 http://www.danwilt.com/index.php/spirituality-the-formation-of-the-worship-leader-assisi/#comment-24032 Well when reading Gregory of Nyssa’s excerpts I was partly uninspired and partly inspired, I kind of had mixed views on his stuff. So the only thing that really touched me on a personal level was ‘The Unattainable Commandment’, I think this touched me because the concept of reaching perfection seems so far away from reality. So therefore I was kind of reassured by knowing that this is unattainable, I think that people try so hard to come across as perfect and normally the people who are honest with who they are, probably are closer to perfection than others. It’s funny because I find it really easy to come across better than I am but I really want to pursue an honesty to myself and others about who I am and how imperfect I am. Also I think that when Gregory asks how we find boundaries if there are non to find, I would suggest that our discernment could guide us to find boundary and realistic reaches to virtue. Anyway that’s pretty much all I got for now….. Well when reading Gregory of Nyssa’s excerpts I was partly uninspired and partly inspired, I kind of had mixed views on his stuff. So the only thing that really touched me on a personal level was ‘The Unattainable Commandment’, I think this touched me because the concept of reaching perfection seems so far away from reality. So therefore I was kind of reassured by knowing that this is unattainable, I think that people try so hard to come across as perfect and normally the people who are honest with who they are, probably are closer to perfection than others. It’s funny because I find it really easy to come across better than I am but I really want to pursue an honesty to myself and others about who I am and how imperfect I am. Also I think that when Gregory asks how we find boundaries if there are non to find, I would suggest that our discernment could guide us to find boundary and realistic reaches to virtue. Anyway that’s pretty much all I got for now…..

]]> By: Administrator http://www.danwilt.com/spirituality-the-formation-of-the-worship-leader-assisi/#comment-23953 Administrator Thu, 15 Feb 2007 02:22:59 +0000 http://www.danwilt.com/index.php/spirituality-the-formation-of-the-worship-leader-assisi/#comment-23953 Good response, Dan. How did you respond to the Gregory Of Nyssa piece? Good response, Dan. How did you respond to the Gregory Of Nyssa piece?

]]> By: Dan Frye http://www.danwilt.com/spirituality-the-formation-of-the-worship-leader-assisi/#comment-23935 Dan Frye Wed, 14 Feb 2007 23:37:28 +0000 http://www.danwilt.com/index.php/spirituality-the-formation-of-the-worship-leader-assisi/#comment-23935 Looking at St Francis’ “Show Me What Is Best” it brings up some resent conversations with friends, firstly the fact that St Francis didn’t believe in himself to form an answer to a question from God brings up a very huge issue with a lot of Christians. This was also a topic of conversation that I had much confusion with myself. I decided that there is a danger in only relying on others wisdom and there must be a point that you yourself have to make a decision purely based on you own relationship with God. The argument was that my friend thought that because she doesn’t hear God clearly it means that she can’t rely on herself to make a Godly decision but instead she thought that always seeking council from her was the only responsible thing to do. I however said that without making decisions on your best knowledge and gut feeling about what God might want, then how can you progress to being someone who hears clearly and without putting time into listening then how can you ever expect to clearly hear! I believe that St Francis did have wisdom in seeking council but I also think that he should also be relying on his own answer from God, I would say that this is a fine balance because we shouldn’t forget that the people who we are finding wisdom in are broken people as well and are no more holy than any other. I really liked the section of that text that talked about St Francis preaching to birds and telling them that they are really loved by God and also that they should praise God in everything that they do because they have received such a gift ‘the sky!’ This entire concept really hit home because sometimes I think that we as humans take this earth for granted and should really be looking to the earth for more wisdom, even from birds and bees, maybe they have the right idea about life! Praise God by being a good bird. I have written a song with a friend of mine not that long ago that talks about the earth being God’s earth and we are here as caretakers. It talks about borders and divides and how we need to get a stronger idea of why we are here, anyway the point is that this section reminds me that we are responsible for these birds and their journeys and survival. What a responsibility we have! That’s pretty much it for now! Dan Frye Looking at St Francis’ “Show Me What Is Best” it brings up some resent conversations with friends, firstly the fact that St Francis didn’t believe in himself to form an answer to a question from God brings up a very huge issue with a lot of Christians. This was also a topic of conversation that I had much confusion with myself. I decided that there is a danger in only relying on others wisdom and there must be a point that you yourself have to make a decision purely based on you own relationship with God. The argument was that my friend thought that because she doesn’t hear God clearly it means that she can’t rely on herself to make a Godly decision but instead she thought that always seeking council from her was the only responsible thing to do. I however said that without making decisions on your best knowledge and gut feeling about what God might want, then how can you progress to being someone who hears clearly and without putting time into listening then how can you ever expect to clearly hear! I believe that St Francis did have wisdom in seeking council but I also think that he should also be relying on his own answer from God, I would say that this is a fine balance because we shouldn’t forget that the people who we are finding wisdom in are broken people as well and are no more holy than any other.

I really liked the section of that text that talked about St Francis preaching to birds and telling them that they are really loved by God and also that they should praise God in everything that they do because they have received such a gift ‘the sky!’ This entire concept really hit home because sometimes I think that we as humans take this earth for granted and should really be looking to the earth for more wisdom, even from birds and bees, maybe they have the right idea about life! Praise God by being a good bird. I have written a song with a friend of mine not that long ago that talks about the earth being God’s earth and we are here as caretakers. It talks about borders and divides and how we need to get a stronger idea of why we are here, anyway the point is that this section reminds me that we are responsible for these birds and their journeys and survival. What a responsibility we have!

That’s pretty much it for now!

Dan Frye

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